War, Leadership Units

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MS - Meaghan Smith
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Re: War, Leadership Units

Post by MS - Meaghan Smith » Mon Jul 22, 2019 11:52 am

I believe it reduces morale by one level.

Also it reduces province level by 1 and holdings (law, guild, temple) levels by 1 if they were maxed against the province level (if not maxed, they don't drop).
Meaghan 'the Smith'

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MS - Meaghan Smith
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Re: War, Leadership Units

Post by MS - Meaghan Smith » Mon Jul 22, 2019 11:56 am

Pillaging is the less-targeted, but more direct way of removing enemy income and opportunities. It is less efficient in action economy, but provides an immediate gain to the pillager and an immediate and lasting loss to the pillagee.

Say it is a level 5 province. It would take 5 actions to pillage it down to 0 (and all attendant holdings). These would have to be rebuilt via Settle/Rule actions.
Occupying the province would take 1 action. Reducing its holdings to 0 would occur in the second action. Province is intact and able to be contested at some point.
Meaghan 'the Smith'

Baroness-Elector of Graven, Countess of Gravendale, Merchant-Princess of the Graven Trading Federated Order

"What has been built cannot be destroyed, save by those without vision, heart, or inspiration."

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TH - The Hunt
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Re: War, Leadership Units

Post by TH - The Hunt » Mon Jul 22, 2019 12:02 pm

Occupation ties up troops, and conquest leaves a vulnerability. The main advantage to pillaging, and the reason why the Unseelie use it so much, is that it allows the army to leave quickly without exposing its leaders to regency loss, while the target will remain impacted for decades. It's very difficult to get province levels back during this 'ice age' scenario, since only 1/2 of summers are eligible times for it, and 3-5 seasons aren't summer.
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JB - Jana Boulderbrew
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Re: War, Leadership Units

Post by JB - Jana Boulderbrew » Mon Jul 22, 2019 12:19 pm

My point is that the game rules do not define it. As one of the newer players items like this not being defined has been rather frustrating. If Juan is updating the rules post, it is a good opportunity to flesh out the rules for pillaging.
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MS - Meaghan Smith
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Re: War, Leadership Units

Post by MS - Meaghan Smith » Mon Jul 22, 2019 12:25 pm

A majority of the rules were originally from the rulebook. Over time, as the game changed, the rules which were changed/modified were listed and slowly codified.

That said, yep, Pillaging and Province Levy could both be updated :)
Meaghan 'the Smith'

Baroness-Elector of Graven, Countess of Gravendale, Merchant-Princess of the Graven Trading Federated Order

"What has been built cannot be destroyed, save by those without vision, heart, or inspiration."

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BS - Torpor
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Re: War, Leadership Units

Post by BS - Torpor » Mon Jul 22, 2019 12:40 pm

What about occupying your own province? It does not really make sense to have that take as long a time as moving into a hostile province and start taking control.
Tor'por
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MS - Meaghan Smith
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Re: War, Leadership Units

Post by MS - Meaghan Smith » Mon Jul 22, 2019 12:45 pm

While I would love that, it does change the dynamic for war. Occupying your province can be as difficult as taking hostile ground, particularly when the law and temples say are against you :)
Meaghan 'the Smith'

Baroness-Elector of Graven, Countess of Gravendale, Merchant-Princess of the Graven Trading Federated Order

"What has been built cannot be destroyed, save by those without vision, heart, or inspiration."

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TH - The Hunt
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Re: War, Leadership Units

Post by TH - The Hunt » Mon Jul 22, 2019 1:16 pm

It's a little easier, since you can move your units to the province before using Declare War. Normally that would be impossible (unless you're betraying an ally). So it only ever takes 3 war moves to occupy your own province, while it normally takes a minimum of 4 to occupy an enemy province.

I think the reason it's difficult is because you're replacing your civilian law enforcement with your army. The only thing that makes that less messy is the lack of resistance, it's still unpopular and disruptive.
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MS - Meaghan Smith
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Re: War, Leadership Units

Post by MS - Meaghan Smith » Mon Jul 22, 2019 1:41 pm

It takes three to occupy an enemy province (again presuming the effort is not disrupted). The movement into the province initiates both the battle and attempt at occupation.
Meaghan 'the Smith'

Baroness-Elector of Graven, Countess of Gravendale, Merchant-Princess of the Graven Trading Federated Order

"What has been built cannot be destroyed, save by those without vision, heart, or inspiration."

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TH - The Hunt
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Re: War, Leadership Units

Post by TH - The Hunt » Mon Jul 22, 2019 1:46 pm

That's not right. It shouldn't be possible to begin occupation until after the unit is in the province and the enemy is defeated.
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