The Gods - but still under construction

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HaQ - Hakim al-Qadr
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Re: The Gods - but still under construction

Post by HaQ - Hakim al-Qadr » Tue Jul 07, 2020 10:52 am

Rhyel is the best God? I disagree. The removal of the Forest-Source bonus is pretty large along with removing the Summoning the Forests. The +1 chain is okay but irrelevant if you are multiclass. It kind of allows you not to need a Thief for trade - but that is hugely suboptimal for Regency Points.

As an adventurer - Priests of Rhyel can kind of do everything - but that is just options. You cannot actually do 3 things at once. They cannot fight though. They are utility support character that allows you to run with the Guilder or Bard on an adventure basically because you don't need a Thief.
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HaQ - Hakim al-Qadr
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Re: The Gods - but still under construction

Post by HaQ - Hakim al-Qadr » Tue Jul 07, 2020 10:56 am

With restricted Buildings - adding them back in "stealth" via the faiths is interesting. But I actually think you should model it more like Nesirie and Bielamog. A pseudo-building bonus and/or an additional bonus on a current building.
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TPK - The Pirates
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Re: The Gods - but still under construction

Post by TPK - The Pirates » Tue Jul 07, 2020 10:57 am

Mikka was a mighty 3rd level priest with good intentions and no understanding of the real world. He liked to believe in fairy tales, unicorns, and rainbows.

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Re: The Gods - but still under construction

Post by TPK - The Pirates » Tue Jul 07, 2020 11:04 am

BSB - Blue Skull Barons wrote:
Tue Jul 07, 2020 9:50 am
Haelyn could use a dogma edit.

With the shifting to a Good deity, he probably isn't keen on killing angels anymore. Or perhaps maybe a general prohibition against summons, as things crossing the shadow realm from the outer planes is no bueno.

The Unseelie enemy should maybe be shifted (unless they remain campaign relevant) to maybe all sidhe, or anti-religious Sidhe.
All Outsiders are dangerous, even those who drape themselves with the wings of angels. Man and his fellow creatures of Cerilia are not playthings for the creatures from other planes of existence. Too often have creatures from the planes sought to twist and change the journey for the people of Cerilia.

The Unseelie have to go because they made mom and dad mad and have continuously tried to exterminate/enslave humanity.

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HaQ - Hakim al-Qadr
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Re: The Gods - but still under construction

Post by HaQ - Hakim al-Qadr » Tue Jul 07, 2020 11:07 am

So Banon doesn't gain Training Grounds for example - but maybe a Cathedral to Banon grants a few. Or his ability to add a bonus training point is expanded a bit.

Maybe Architect doesn't get a Cathedral - but if they take Training Grounds - they get a free Agitate (in that province) any time they actually train units in the province? The Architect's people love discipline and seeing well trained armies marching about...
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Re: The Gods - but still under construction

Post by HaQ - Hakim al-Qadr » Tue Jul 07, 2020 11:09 am

Or for the Architect:
Every Temple 2 boosts the largest Law holding in the same province by 1 for purposes of what can be recruited/trained. Make it more synergy and less Priests = Better.
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Re: The Gods - but still under construction

Post by WB - Water's Blessing » Tue Jul 07, 2020 12:45 pm

I like RR's suggestions. Some other ideas for substitutes for buildings. Just coming up with ideas, so some may be unbalanced. Some ideas listed under one faith might work for others on the list as well.

Architect -> Cathedral
Arawn -> Academy
Moradin -> Academy
Mats -> Lab
Banon -> Training Ground

Architect
"Goddess of Humanity" (Political) -> A Temple of the Architect counts as an official/unofficial state temple in any human province it exists. This status cannot be cancelled by decree.
"Loyalty to the Emperor" (Military) -> Units mustered by a priest/paladin of the Architect cannot be targeted by enchantment/charm spells, and have X bonus to morale
"Goddess of the Sun" (Anti-Shadow) -> At X level, priests of the Architect may destroy undead units per the "Light of Reason" Great blood ability

Arawn
"Vengence will be Mine" (Personal)-> Priests of Arawn may designate an enemy who (in their view) has wronged them. Priests will have a +2 to all rolls against their sworn enemy, until either their enemy is defeated or they swear vengeance against a different enemy.
"Trust No One" (Political)-> Cathedrals of Arawn allow the regent to create a spy ring in their capital province at level 2. They may create and additional spy ring in a province where they have a temple present at cathedral level 4.
"Make the Mages Kneel" (Military) -> As the god of magic and of conquest, units raised by the temple of Arawn have the ability to target sources when occupying a province.

Moradin
"The Scholar Under the Hill" (Technology)-> Cathedrals of Moradin provide +2 bonus to research per level, in addition to their other powers
"God of the Mountain Folk" (Political) -> A Temple of Moradin counts as an official/unofficial state temple in any dwarven/orog province it exists. This status cannot be cancelled by decree.
"The Scholar's Insight" (Magical) -> In addition to the listed realm spells, temples of Moradin may select one additional realm spell of the regent's choice that fits with the particular focus of their version of the temple (with the approval of the DM). Priests of Moradin may change their bonus realm spell after game start by conducting a research action.

Mats
"The God of the Road" (Military) -> Units raised by a temple of Mats have +1 move
"The Call of Heroes" (Adventure) -> Priests of Mats provide +1 EPL per 3 levels to any adventure troupe they join. On main adventures, they may re-roll one roll per adventure, per 3 levels
"Raise a Glass" (Building) -> Cathedrals of Mats are drinking halls of great (or infamous, depending on who you ask) repute. It is said that their liquid courage has fueled many great deeds, but have also caused many great deeds to need to be performed. Priests of Mats and unlanded adventurers may use any one bonus potion they wish on an adventure occurring within 2 provinces of a cathedral of Mats. The province hosting the Cathedral is more likely to be hit by adventure random events

Banon
"Prepare for War" (Military) -> Cathedrals of Banon add 1 training point per level for priests. Cathedrals can also provide shelter from the elements for a number of units equal to their level.
"Guide the People" (Political) -> Temples of Banon count as law holdings for the purposes of supporting or opposing the creation and ruling of law and guild holdings.
"Reourceful Productivity" (Resource) -> Cathedrals of Banon count as a second resource of the regent's choosing for the province they are located in.
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TH - The Hunt
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Re: The Gods - but still under construction

Post by TH - The Hunt » Tue Jul 07, 2020 1:17 pm

I think the 'Loyalty to the Emperor' trait should only apply to holy units. Aside from tier Vs raised by a temple, I don't know what counts as 'holy units'.

I don't think a Great blood ability should be replicable by all priests of a given deity. Maybe the Architect could have a discounted version of Mass Destruction that only works on Undead.

Speaking of which, Arawn could have a version of Defection that only works on undead, and is permanent. Raising undead and then 'reforging' them might make more sense than conjuring 'Forged' outright, regardless, and being able to take control of others' undead would give him a useful role that makes sense with his ambitions.

I'm concerned about all these abilities related to training units. It seems like priests are muscling in on the niche of warriors while dismissing their own responsibilities. (They're doing that to wizards and rogues, too, by having powerful offensive and utility spells, and ways to boost guilds, trade, and espionage. Other classes, and even other faiths aren't getting any way to push back.)
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Re: The Gods - but still under construction

Post by JB - Jontinius Bruin » Tue Jul 07, 2020 1:22 pm

This is all too complicated.

Not elegant at all.

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DM Juan
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Re: The Gods - but still under construction

Post by DM Juan » Tue Jul 07, 2020 1:25 pm

Removed Rhyel trade, instead granting them +1 Spy Ring (a pseudo Custom House 1) - I agree it makes more sense for them to be thievery related, and less about trade.

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