Elves Autoscout function overpowered

Post Reply
DH - Dweomerheart
Posts: 235
Joined: Wed Jan 15, 2020 10:24 am

Elves Autoscout function overpowered

Post by DH - Dweomerheart » Thu Mar 04, 2021 7:02 pm

It seems that somebody found a rule which will win a game in using it exclusively as strategy:

Don' t you think that auto scout function from elves is to overpowered- not really clear why elves without extra gb/training should be faster moving through high mountains then karambul, who are living there knowing every niche and way.

You can´t really fight an army who are able to move away as soon they are attacked.
They are able to attack anywhere without other races able to amass an army fast enough... so all others will be bancrupt if they try, because they need an big army in every province to avoid the defeat or castles and roads on all borders which is impossible in turn 10 of a game like this?
I am not for changing rules in mid game, but for karambul wizards it was possible to delete magic save bonus in mid game in spite of not having a highh impact on game. This elven scout rule is just unbelievable....

User avatar
DCT - Destiny Corben-Talas
Posts: 177
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2018 9:00 am
Location: Las Palmas, Canary Islands

Re: Elves Autoscout function overpowered

Post by DCT - Destiny Corben-Talas » Thu Mar 04, 2021 7:05 pm

Well, Sidhe units are better in all. Period..,). Same cost, huge bonus to archers, and can build from T1, that isw why sidhe and half sidhe are so popular. I think half of the human kingdoms are really half-sidhe..,)
“No dimensions are closed to the ones in service of the Universal Law.”
Nur Hayati Corben-Talas

User avatar
AaH - Avicerra al Hamam
Posts: 414
Joined: Wed Aug 22, 2018 8:20 am

Re: Elves Autoscout function overpowered

Post by AaH - Avicerra al Hamam » Thu Mar 04, 2021 7:10 pm

I think the scouting ability is just to powerful. An elven archer can run 12 provinces in a turn. What the scounting ability should look like is that you can enter any province no matter what the movement cost and stop there if no more movement is available but not run through multiple difficult terrain provinces.

User avatar
LMC - Lord Mayor Cowell
Posts: 218
Joined: Sun Feb 09, 2020 5:04 pm

Re: Elves Autoscout function overpowered

Post by LMC - Lord Mayor Cowell » Thu Mar 04, 2021 7:16 pm

They grow slower than everyone except possibly karamhul though. Thats a pretty big downside in this sort of a game, starting from scratch. And for the build with wood only, I think maybe it should be max 0 guild to do that. Hurts more financially.

Personally, I think dwarfs should have the same, but in their case limited to mountains.
Lord Mayor Cowell VI

User avatar
JB - Jontinius Bruin
Posts: 305
Joined: Wed Aug 08, 2018 8:13 am

Re: Elves Autoscout function overpowered

Post by JB - Jontinius Bruin » Thu Mar 04, 2021 7:18 pm

Simple, elegant, logical, thematical, and most importantly balanced solution is auto scout in Forests only.

User avatar
HaQ - Hakim al-Qadr
Posts: 144
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 6:46 pm

Re: Elves Autoscout function overpowered

Post by HaQ - Hakim al-Qadr » Thu Mar 04, 2021 7:21 pm

It just means that everyone goes back to building only scout-armies. A better solution for long-term viability is to make the "scout" function grant bonus movement not ignore terrain movement cost. An all-scout army of any race can move through all terrain for 1 movement cost as it is anyway.
Turn to Avani before you return to Avani
Hakim al-Qadr
Mayor of Barniere

User avatar
JB - Jontinius Bruin
Posts: 305
Joined: Wed Aug 08, 2018 8:13 am

Re: Elves Autoscout function overpowered

Post by JB - Jontinius Bruin » Thu Mar 04, 2021 7:23 pm

That too. Could flatten things as Mishrak said.

Scout becomes only the spy adjacent provinces ability and add +2 move to units that had scout.

User avatar
TH - The Hunt
Emperor
Posts: 1224
Joined: Sat Aug 04, 2018 4:27 pm

Re: Elves Autoscout function overpowered

Post by TH - The Hunt » Thu Mar 04, 2021 7:25 pm

2 move times 3 war moves times 3 actions. That's 18 provinces per turn, if every war move of every action is used... and no rivers get in the way.

Elven scouts would still have scout movement even if other elven units didn't, of course.

Scout movement is mainly a benefit early on. Halflings also have it, and yet the most powerful realms still have been dominated by humans, game after game, despite humans being the only ones without any racial unit bonuses.

Dwarven armies have advantages, too; they have more morale, a bonus to fight in mountains, but they absolutely need roads, or they can't defend their lands. Dwarven roads in mountains are easy to build, mind.
"The Hunt rides. The Hunt protects."

User avatar
TH - The Hunt
Emperor
Posts: 1224
Joined: Sat Aug 04, 2018 4:27 pm

Re: Elves Autoscout function overpowered

Post by TH - The Hunt » Thu Mar 04, 2021 7:26 pm

Worth noting: Even a level 1 fortification makes moving armies past that province without taking the castle impossible. Outright impossible.
"The Hunt rides. The Hunt protects."

User avatar
TH - The Hunt
Emperor
Posts: 1224
Joined: Sat Aug 04, 2018 4:27 pm

Re: Elves Autoscout function overpowered

Post by TH - The Hunt » Thu Mar 04, 2021 7:33 pm

As far as thematics go, the idea is that elves are more part of the land than they are inhabitants of it. If elven units were inhibited by a lack of roads, they would have a reason to build roads, which would be out of place. I don't think it would be thematically appropriate to remove the scout movement from elves or halflings. Since dwarves are defensive and focused on artifice in the first place, it seems fair to expect them to rely on built assets.

If elves need to be balanced, they could be given penalties to reflect their lower unit size, or restrictions on build projects to reflect their aversion to building things.
"The Hunt rides. The Hunt protects."

Post Reply