Elves Autoscout function overpowered

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TH - The Hunt
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Re: Elves Autoscout function overpowered

Post by TH - The Hunt » Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:47 pm

I guess it doesn't matter, since Birmail can't handle land trade routes without roads, and trade is still an important source of income even for realms who have no interest in this being the case.

In Birthright, only humans build ships, everyone else has to acquire their ships from the humans. And elves and dwarves have little reason to do so, since they can't cope with the conditions at sea. Sidhelien lived in Cerilia for ten to fifteen thousand years without ever sailing anywhere. Same goes for every other race on the continent before the Brecht explorers arrive... and none of them started building ships after that, either. Even goblin realms didn't build navies, as far as I can tell, though some of them made a lot of profit selling wood to those who did.
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WM - The Waste Mage
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Re: Elves Autoscout function overpowered

Post by WM - The Waste Mage » Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:52 pm

Elves no reason to sail anywhere.
Dwarves sink and they can eat rock so no desire or reason to go anywhere.
Halflings just travel through the Shadow world.
Goblins and Orogs don't have the technical ability or civilization level to build anything but crude rafts.

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TH - The Hunt
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Re: Elves Autoscout function overpowered

Post by TH - The Hunt » Thu Mar 04, 2021 11:01 pm

And... Gnolls resort to cannibalism before they can make it to the next island?
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WB - Water's Blessing
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Re: Elves Autoscout function overpowered

Post by WB - Water's Blessing » Thu Mar 04, 2021 11:04 pm

Tuarhievel isn't a great example because they were considered really weird by other elves for allowing guild development in their land.

I'm fine with elven realms having temples and guilds, but I'm also a proponent of elves who build temples and guilds eventually turning into goblins. That's the cannon for this story-line, I believe.
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DM Juan
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Re: Elves Autoscout function overpowered

Post by DM Juan » Thu Mar 04, 2021 11:08 pm

Rhyel created goblins, by giving his Sidhelien followers an afterlife. They were short lived, so they could rejoin Rhyel all the faster. In the cosmology, Sidhelien do not go to the afterlife of the Gods. The trade off, in effect, was by giving them "an immortal soul" they lost their corporeal immortality.

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DM Juan
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Re: Elves Autoscout function overpowered

Post by DM Juan » Thu Mar 04, 2021 11:14 pm

(of course, sidhelien would say they have immortality and rejoin the world/stars, etc)

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TH - The Hunt
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Re: Elves Autoscout function overpowered

Post by TH - The Hunt » Thu Mar 04, 2021 11:18 pm

Or become Seelie, and then when they die as Seelie become Sidhe again. Or something.
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Re: Elves Autoscout function overpowered

Post by MaH - Meganno al Hamam » Fri Mar 05, 2021 2:59 am

Don‘t try to change the original theme, please. In modern war, any Unit who are able to move so much faster then everybody else would be consider a air unit or highly motorized. And would cost 10times as much as others or more. Perhaps scouts should be limited to one unit per regent with this ability and all other scouts are only looking to next Provinzen or scout units should be much less effective in combat. To damn all non scouts to own only 1 province is not a good idea idea(spreading) because only the claim of a province will secur new holdings. Perhaps it’s also feasible to allow scouts fast movement in their own lands. What is an exploit is to use scouts as main army, because they are more efficient then other non scout ones of other races. That in my opinion should be changed, because otherwise you are forcing all regents to build streets and roads before claiming new provinces except elves and halflings- they can happily claim without an expensive defensive network.

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Re: Elves Autoscout function overpowered

Post by LMC - Lord Mayor Cowell » Fri Mar 05, 2021 3:08 am

I really disagree at the being unable to do anything to grow in time against someone optimized. Attacking is harder than defending. 3 units each, and forts on the border would not have been that difficult by turn 8. Or a better roadnet. Or other tactics.
But being conquered is part of the game. you don´t fight to the death as a small lord. You take advantages where you can find them. If Mishrak wins, then we have a game with an emperor, but a player one. We havent really done that before, I´t be fine. There will be rebellions eventually.

Humans additional settler at start is huge too. And I doubt Mishrak have even built much using only wood, if any. I would guess he have mostly used starter resources anyway, would be more efficent, and anyone could do without being sidhe.

There are a few players that play min/max. They outgrows those who do not. I must definitely do not, and tend to be behind. but even I...

There are plenty ways to stop scout units. some ways available for everyone, some just for wizards and so on. They are not unreachable. You do need to adapt.
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Re: Elves Autoscout function overpowered

Post by AaH - Avicerra al Hamam » Fri Mar 05, 2021 3:27 am

Still beeing able to move 36 provinces in one turn is way to much. I have no problem that elves run faster than Karamhul for example but not by that margine.

Building roads and castles in defense is fine but you have no chanse in hell to beat an elven army if you try to attack them in the forests. Before you have even entered a province as any none wood race, they have run around you and occupied your lands. Sure you could build scouts only but what game is it if you have to build scouts to attack? They should be for gathering information not a main army.

Not everyone has grain access in the begining so building scouts early is not possible for everyone. And elven irregulars are even better in the first few turns as they are cheap to train. They have move 3 so "only" 27 provinces they can run if not stoped by a river.

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