Poll: New Game

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Are you ready to move on to the next chapter and start a new game?

Yes, everything I wanted to work on is complete.
4
22%
Yes, but there were minor things I wished to resolve.
8
44%
Yes, but there were still major things I wished to resolve.
1
6%
We're in a game?
0
No votes
No, but I had most of the things I was working on resolved.
1
6%
No, and there are major issues I am still workingn on resolving.
4
22%
HELL NO! You can't end my plotting yet!
0
No votes
 
Total votes: 18

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TF - The Fortress
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Re: Poll: New Game

Post by TF - The Fortress » Sun Oct 17, 2021 10:33 am

MF - Morcuan the Fay wrote:
Sun Oct 17, 2021 1:15 am
But there's no war to fight or support from the game itself. Wars are an optional part of the gameplay, and players often don't choose that option. Either way, your friend Sam here isn't using the same definition of 'war game' as you are, his definition of 'wargame' describes any kind of game that's played in an aggressively competitive way (and he seems to think LARPs and V:tM games never are, which is why he's attempting to use them as shorthand for cooperative games or those with sportsmanlike competition, which apparently bit him when he was younger or something).
RC - Riva wrote:
Sun Oct 17, 2021 12:00 am
That the most activity garnered for the past three weeks is on the subject of whether the game is over or not, tends to give credence to the former rather than the latter. The activity level has been almost non-existent until AA asked if it is time to move on.
Efforts to get people to think the game is over, coming from players who want the game to be over for their own advantage, are not evidence that the game is or be over. They are, tautologically, evidence players who very much want to stop the game from continuing very much want to stop the game from continuing. Unconscious or deliberate, they are sabotaging, not self-justifying. But, Juan burns out and stops running because he's sick of this crap, then your prophecy is self-fulfilling. And that's the only kind of fulfillment anyone is going to get out of them.
We agree to disagree on whether this is a war game or not. There is always a war (at least one) and the strategic warfare is clear and present from Turn 1 forward, always.

As to seeking advantage, say what? Those who see the game as over are seeking to begin a new game to engage with a new scenario and start new player-character interactions. There's no advantage seeking in that, everyone starts from the same baseline and builds up again. While we have discussed this, you seek to villify and paint bad intentions on those who are ready to move on, this puts you into an adversarial position as opposed to having a dialogue. Whatever your intentions are for yourself as far as continuing, that's your business, I don't condemn you for your desire -- I also don't claim by continuing you will gain some advantage or whatnot.

This is a shared story experience. As it stands (and of course this could change over time but I believe the trend will continue), there are currently 8 of 12 ready to move on. That's a 2/3 (66%) majority. Asking a game to continue when the majority are clearly in favor of moving on is a disservice to the players, the GM, and the story itself.
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TF - The Fortress
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Re: Poll: New Game

Post by TF - The Fortress » Sun Oct 17, 2021 10:38 am

AB - Alim Büyücü wrote:
Sun Oct 17, 2021 10:29 am
EDIT: If I ever get around to running a Birthright game again, it will probably be a Birthright/VtM mash-up. :D
If I got around to one, I'd be doing a Warhammer world setting I think...although I have toyed with the idea of a Council of Wyrms Birthright game.
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WB - Water's Blessing
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Re: Poll: New Game

Post by WB - Water's Blessing » Sun Oct 17, 2021 10:41 am

RC - Riva wrote:
Sun Oct 17, 2021 10:38 am
AB - Alim Büyücü wrote:
Sun Oct 17, 2021 10:29 am
EDIT: If I ever get around to running a Birthright game again, it will probably be a Birthright/VtM mash-up. :D
If I got around to one, I'd be doing a Warhammer world setting I think...although I have toyed with the idea of a Council of Wyrms Birthright game.
So, basically a game set in the elven empire during the last cycle if you do a Council of Wyrms? ;)
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TH - The Hunt
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Re: Poll: New Game

Post by TH - The Hunt » Sun Oct 17, 2021 10:55 am

There's several reasons we can't trust this poll, besides that less than half the players have participated. One is that it doesn't tell us how many players have participated, only how many forum accounts have participated. Another is that the wording doesn't let players express their views accurately--in particular, it also doesn't let players vote to say whether they will even be willing to play if this game, too, is aborted prematurely. (Not that it would be very helpful, since the anonymity means there's no consequences for using the vote to manipulate others' perceptions rather than to reflect a sincere view.) The most important one for me is that the poll itself follows a campaign to convince players to believe things that aren't true in order to engineer a desired result.

There's advantage-seeking to a game reset for several reasons. When the game is reset, the playing field is levelled, so no one is ahead of anyone else anymore. It cuts down every player who's doing well and elevates every player who's doing poorly. It also locks in the current results, so anyone who appears to be doing well currently will be remembered for what the game state appears to be currently, not for the what happens or is revealed in the future. So ending the game is good for everyone who doesn't like the situation they're in, or who likes the situation (or manufactured perception of the situation) their friends or foes are currently in.

This is indeed a shared story experience, and you're trying to sabotage it because your only investment in it is that you want it to stop here because you don't want to see how it develops unless it develops the way you've been attempting to convince everyone it's going to go ever since you committed to trying to make it happen.

If this was a wargame, you'd have been banned from it ages ago for sabotaging your own side. (That applies to a lot of players, here. It wouldn't really be a game about aristocrats without that going on. Though it's problematic when the sabotage is intended to force the game to reset or otherwise propel OOC objectives.)
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TF - The Fortress
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Re: Poll: New Game

Post by TF - The Fortress » Sun Oct 17, 2021 11:09 am

AB - Alim Büyücü wrote:
Sun Oct 17, 2021 10:41 am
RC - Riva wrote:
Sun Oct 17, 2021 10:38 am
AB - Alim Büyücü wrote:
Sun Oct 17, 2021 10:29 am
EDIT: If I ever get around to running a Birthright game again, it will probably be a Birthright/VtM mash-up. :D
If I got around to one, I'd be doing a Warhammer world setting I think...although I have toyed with the idea of a Council of Wyrms Birthright game.
So, basically a game set in the elven empire during the last cycle if you do a Council of Wyrms? ;)
Yep, LOL!
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Face each day like a storm;
Respect it;
Fear it;
Endure it;
Thrive in it!

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LK - Lady Katrijn
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Re: Poll: New Game

Post by LK - Lady Katrijn » Sun Oct 17, 2021 11:21 am

Wow, so much hostility between the various players participating in the discussion.

I guess I'll add my own thoughts. I picked the option where I was ready to move on, though I still have minor things to resolve. Many of my last turns have been quite uneventful, simply repeating many of the same actions. Probably my own fault, but I feel like I missed so much that I wouldn't have an idea what to do for research other than more military tech. I am not involved with religion or a deity either, so don't have anything to do with the ascenscion.
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TH - The Hunt
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Re: Poll: New Game

Post by TH - The Hunt » Sun Oct 17, 2021 11:37 am

JbH - Jasmina wrote:
Sun Oct 17, 2021 11:21 am
Many of my last turns have been quite uneventful, simply repeating many of the same actions. Probably my own fault, but I feel like I missed so much that I wouldn't have an idea what to do for research other than more military tech. I am not involved with religion or a deity either, so don't have anything to do with the ascension.
You're far from the only one in that situation... That's one of the reasons I don't think the game should end when the pantheon is locked in. Not only is it not locked in like some players are saying, but even when it is, that's essentially the midpoint. After that point, the players who were not involved in the competition between faiths and deities would be the ones in the best position to drive the story to its conclusion. The conclusion would be reached once we know what the new status quo is following the drama of the divine ascension competition (especially since it's destructive to its participants).

I talked about that part of it a bit in the other thread earlier. viewtopic.php?f=70&t=3936&start=110#p69413
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CSF - Flint
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Re: Poll: New Game

Post by CSF - Flint » Sun Oct 17, 2021 11:51 am

JbH - Jasmina wrote:
Sun Oct 17, 2021 11:21 am
Wow, so much hostility between the various players participating in the discussion.
That's just Crazy Amy. She is a toxic ball of vitriol who lives for suffering and shits on everything she touches. You'll notice the rest of us are capable of having productive discussions and disagreements with each other, she is the common element in all the acidic antisocial interactions.
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TH - The Hunt
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Re: Poll: New Game

Post by TH - The Hunt » Sun Oct 17, 2021 12:05 pm

The common element has been you, John, and Sam. Sam spends more time trying to troll or blow up the game than on playing it, and you and John are the ones who have been hellbent on trying to tear me down and lock me up even if you have to keep harming yourselves and turn every interaction into a mass of pure spite to do it.

You know that the Trumpisms don't help your case, right?
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TH - The Hunt
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Re: Poll: New Game

Post by TH - The Hunt » Sun Oct 17, 2021 12:26 pm

https://www.psychologytoday.com/intl/bl ... u-feel-bad Here's a good read. "Negative social potency". Try to reduce yours, because that's where the problem is.

I am not enjoying this. I'm just defending my own rather humble position that players should get to enjoy the game world, characters, and domains they've invested dozens of hours into developing, instead of being told they can't do anything and need to start over because a few players who have been unbelievably influential despite their extreme social violence want a quick fix, and are worried about losing the pole position if they don't get it, right now.
"The Hunt rides. The Hunt protects."

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