Undefined how to bid - Subversion

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TH - The Hunt
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Re: Undefined how to bid - Subversion

Post by TH - The Hunt » Mon Feb 22, 2021 8:34 pm

I'd think that's the main thing the spell is for, instigation.
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JB - Jontinius Bruin
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Re: Undefined how to bid - Subversion

Post by JB - Jontinius Bruin » Mon Feb 22, 2021 8:38 pm

That and "Vulfrum's Celeritous Lieutenant"

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DM Juan
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Re: Undefined how to bid - Subversion

Post by DM Juan » Mon Feb 22, 2021 8:53 pm

Let's go with Option 1, I guess.

You both secretly bid, with no knowledge of what each other are bidding. The higher bidder wins (tie goes to the caster), the defender only has to defeat the "extra bid" they don't have to match the underlying spell.

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TH - The Hunt
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Re: Undefined how to bid - Subversion

Post by TH - The Hunt » Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:00 pm

With those rules, I think I'd never use it unless I was confident the target either had no RP or wasn't going to bother spending it. But maybe I'm just lacking imagination for situations where casting the spell and bidding enough to force it through (regardless of the response) would be worth doing.
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DM Juan
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Re: Undefined how to bid - Subversion

Post by DM Juan » Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:02 pm

Subversion is more useful to force chaos, or to sneak in an extra action (have a wizard trade one of their actions for you to get an extra action, for 3-12RP). It is sometimes better than Defection, if you have more RP than the target.

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DM Juan
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Re: Undefined how to bid - Subversion

Post by DM Juan » Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:05 pm

Or if you hit a number of their units with subversion, they spook and bid a lot of RP to oppose it, but you bid nothing to force it through, and follow up with a second subversion?

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TH - The Hunt
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Re: Undefined how to bid - Subversion

Post by TH - The Hunt » Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:09 pm

Might work as a way to gauge or provoke a response even if you don't intend it to succeed, yeah.

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RaH - Rassan al Hamam
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Re: Undefined how to bid - Subversion

Post by RaH - Rassan al Hamam » Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:24 pm

So do you know before you bid what the attacker has targeted? like how many units?

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WB - Water's Blessing
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Re: Undefined how to bid - Subversion

Post by WB - Water's Blessing » Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:33 pm

VV - Vic Vru wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:24 pm
So do you know before you bid what the attacker has targeted? like how many units?
I made that mistake too. They're talking about subversion, not defection. With subversion, you can target the whole army. So, assume all of them.
Last edited by WB - Water's Blessing on Tue Feb 23, 2021 1:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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RaH - Rassan al Hamam
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Re: Undefined how to bid - Subversion

Post by RaH - Rassan al Hamam » Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:38 pm

Yea I mean you know if an army/LT/Holding is targeted ?

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